Warren Made Eerily Prophetic Request

Before Saddleback pastor Rick Warren knew his son had died, he asked his brother-in-law to deliver a sermon that seemed to predict tragedy.

The message delivered at Saddleback Church on Saturday night was eerily prophetic for Pastor Rick Warren, who ceded the microphone to his brother-in-law.

Tom Holladay, the church’s teaching pastor, delivered the news to those in attendance that the youngest son of Warren and his wife, Kay, had died “earlier this week, and they are facing that together, walking through that together."

Holladay said he could tell by the audience reaction that some had not received Warren’s email to the congregation and were learning about Matthew Warren's death for the first time.

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“Your support, your encouragement, your being here means a lot to us,” Holladay said. “We’re a family, and we’re going to walk through this together. What are we going to do tonight? We’re going to pray together for them, we’re going to worship together, we’re going to look to the God who can give us hope in any circumstance, we’re going to look together at what God’s word has to say about hope, and we’re going to cling together and realize that in God we can find strength that we can find nowhere else.”

Holladay also shared a story that Warren’s absence on the stage had been determined even before Matthew’s death Friday morning from a self-inflicted shotgun wound.

“Pastor Rick gave me a call and said he’d been to the doctor and discovered he has double pneumonia,” Holladay said, joking that Warren “often has something like that happen after preaching 8 million Easter services and hugging everyone during those services.

“And so he said—and this was before he heard about Matthew and his death—‘I’d like you to speak this weekend, I’m not going to be able to, and there’s a message I’ve had on my mind that I’d like you to share with the church. It’s a message based on a little book I’ve been reading, and the title of the book is How to Survive The Worst Day of Your Life.

“We have a pastor who is spiritually sensitive, who’s listening to the Lord and even before he knew how much he would need it and we would need it, he said this is the message to pass along, so this is the message I’m going to pass along to you.”

After a song at the conclusion of the 40-minute message, and acknowledging the sanctuary was filled with others hurting as well, Holladay left the congregants with a final message and some insight into the comfort the Warrens are taking from the outpouring of thoughts and prayers.

“You know that your prayers for Rick and Kay and everybody—I’ve said it two or three times and I’ll say it again—they’re felt more deeply than you can possibly imagine,” Holladay said, “so you just keep praying.”

TELL US IN THE COMMENTS: What message would you like to share with Rick and Kay Warren, their family and those touched by Matthew's life?

jb April 10, 2013 at 02:56 PM
tiny April 10, 2013 at 03:31 PM
I'll say this and then done. Life is not easy especially in this economy. The belief of once saved always saved is easier to follow. Just thinking back how life must of been 1000 to 2000 years ago where people probably didn't live near as long of lives and death was closer with disease, etc. Today we live to our 70s or 80s. A Catholic higher-up told me once that when life becomes more difficult then the church grows.
Tina Lee April 10, 2013 at 04:16 PM
Tiny! Here's a link about sin of omission. The director's name is Hank Hanegraaff; he's a trustworthy source. http://www.equip.org/search/?q=sin%20of%20omission Sins of Omission Not forgiving (Matthew 6:15) Failing to honor others (Romans 12:9) Failing to keep your fervor (Romans, 12:9) Failing to serve or give (Romans, 12:9) Failing to live at peace (Romans 12:18) Failing to love God (Deuteronomy 6:4; Mark 12:30) Failing to love your neighbor as yourself (Mark 12:31) Failing to trust God (Proverbs 3:5; Isaiah 26:4) Failing to trust Christ (John 14:1) Failing to worship God (Deuteronomy 6:13) Failing to honor God (Proverbs 3:9; John 5:23) Failing to honor the Son (John 5:23) Failing to believe in Jesus (John 3:16–18; 6:29) Failing to honor one’s parents (Exodus 20:12) Failing to give thanks to God (Psalm 105:1; Romans 1:21) Failing to glorify God (Psalm 34:3; Romans 1:21) Failing to fear the Lord (Deuteronomy 6:13; Proverbs 3:7) Failing to test new teaching by Scripture (1 Thessalonians 5:21;Acts 17:11) Failing to discern and guard against false teachers and prophets (Matthew 7:15–20;Acts 20:28–31) Failing to learn and believe Scripture (Deuteronomy 6:6; 2 Timothy 2:15) Failing to guard life and doctrine (1 Timothy 4:16) Failing to repay debts (Romans 13:7) Failing to care for orphans and widows in distress (James 1:20) Failing to defend the faith (1 Peter 3:15) Failing to share the gospel (Matthew 28:19) and doing those things that we should not.
Tina Lee April 10, 2013 at 04:20 PM
But all sins are alike to God. He does not measure sins from a little lie to a murder. The wages of sin is death and JESUS had already bought it by dying on the cross for us all. Only Jesus Christ can represent us and be our advocate to the Heavenly Father. It is by Grace that saves us by our own repentance and acceptance of Christ thus a RELATIONSHIP, GUIDANCE and FELLOWSHIP with Him through the Holy Spirit. RELATIONSHIP not religion.
Tina Lee April 10, 2013 at 04:31 PM
That's right, Tiny. You have a humble spirit! I can see it from you and encourage it. The best Christians are the ones who have that humble spirit of Christ. As you can see, not many will not have that humility. The once saved ALWAYS saved is a "holier than thou" attitude and it is nothing but vanity that does not trust God to provide but to trust and believe in oneself, no matter what the ages of times are. Vanity is also the first "sin" before God created Adam and Eve. Lucifer, the most talented and beautiful angel that God had ever created committed vanity. In the Book of Isaiah, it described how Lucifer was kicked out of Heaven as a fallen angel along with 1/3 of his demon followers (angels) and landed on earth. Satan is very active on earth and will influence others to be like Him very easily. This is a spiritual warfare and we need God to live right through Jesus Christ by the Holy Sprit. Bless you Tiny! I hope you will grow stronger in the strength of the Lord and wiser by His power and wisdom!
tiny April 10, 2013 at 04:33 PM
Wow, well thanks for all that. So a relationship. But for what purpose in this world? Also, what do you make of this: www.youtube.com/watch?v=dwYLSnX-cdU I've got to go to work now.
Dan Avery April 10, 2013 at 06:41 PM
Tina, I didn't expect you to "get" my satiric comment about the gun. Now I'll explain it to you. First of all, I am not a "follower" of Rick Warren. The man is a bigot and a homophobe and wouldn't know Jesus if he was talking to Him. The main reason being that Jesus said when he came back we wouldn't recognize him, so chances are that he'll come back as one half of a gay couple, or a pregnant Latina crossing the border with a coyote, or maybe looking the way he always did...you know like a middle-eastern man who would be hassled by the TSA and then put on a no fly list or just chucked into Gitmo and forgotten. Now about the gun: you're a bigot. Anyone who's read your comments knows that to be true. You're also not all that bright or educated. Seems like dumb, uneducated bigots always have guns. Or maybe that's just my own bigotry showing. Could be cause I hate dumb, uneducated bigots like yourself. However, the highly educated bigots like Mr. Warren are far far worse.
Dan Avery April 10, 2013 at 06:44 PM
Boy, Tina Lee sounds just like JustUs. Seems JustUs suddenly disappeared or was banned and now we have to deal with the likes of Tina Lee. What are the odds, folks, what are the odds. By the way, you all should take note that on other threads many many people sound just like Tina Lee in Orange County. Especially when it comes to anyone you don't like having the same rights and opportunities you all had.
Dan Avery April 10, 2013 at 06:52 PM
I gotta admit, Tina Lee, you're the type of locust I thought God would rain down onto the homes of these preachers like Warren. You've sort of restored my faith. Odd. But then they always said He works in mysterious ways.
jb April 10, 2013 at 09:13 PM
Dan Avery - I agree. "Tina Lee" started posting a few days after Justus disappeared. Where is "William Bonney", aka Bo Bo/booboo? It is interesting that "he" does not have anything to say about this thread.
Dan Avery April 10, 2013 at 09:33 PM
jb, Weird that eh? Of course Bonney/Bo Bo/booboo crossed the "libel" line on another thread so maybe he's laying low. Notice how Tina says she just go home from work, but was flaming this thread all day? Makes you wonder where she works huh?
Kimberly Richards April 11, 2013 at 09:37 PM
I am so very sorry for your loss. I am praying for you.
ChristieD April 18, 2013 at 02:24 AM
Tina Lee. There are several people here on this blog who go to Chuck Smith's church and they reject your statements entirely, including the ones about how he would endorse your statements. As for rebuking us in the Lord's name; Tina you appear to have some kind of mental illness that you should really check in to. Most of your statements in this blog have shown that you are not standing for God, but rather something inside you that is causing you to lash out at other people, including other believers. As for Chuck Smith's political stances; this is why many churches should lose their tax exempt status. The law is clear: you may have your religious beliefs and you may have your churches, but you may not use your religious beliefs or the stance of your church to effect the rights of other U.S. citizens. Those laws are there to protect ALL churches and religions. Otherwise, who gets to choose? If you want to live in a country where religion dictates the laws and how people are treated, you might perhaps want to move to a country in the Middle East where some countries do choose to mix religion with politics. Enjoy.
Shripathi Kamath April 18, 2013 at 03:54 AM
"Tina you appear to have some kind of mental illness that you should really check in to." Please, let's not go there.
Dusty W Otero April 18, 2013 at 05:30 AM
I think you are all crazy fighting on what you think god said and did not , and the bible is not the only answer,,,lets see proof of what warren gives,,??and all of you hope you have life after death no one knows ,, so get real,,I see on Trinity broadcast there all experts now on ,,what Jesus would of done and didn't,,,do,,,there all praying and taking you r hard worked money,,,I gave 20 years to doctor Schuller and look what happen,,,I go to my own mountain and pray,,,and help all people not just christians,,jews, muslims, buddhists,on and on...let s help all people .. with out getting saved by Jesus,,,all people is what my jesus loved,,,good luck.. I feel for this kid,and maybe if he was separated from the Mega Church life he would be alive ,,I lite 3 incense for his soul last week and I don't see why you think prayer work,,when another country is praying to kill us in usa,,,just a thought,,Prayers and
Tina Lee April 18, 2013 at 09:15 PM
@ChristieD, you need to drop this! This site has been dead for a few weeks. Please let it go. Returning to this site by saying that I have mental illness is insulting to other people who really have it and it makes you look very comical! I had already revealed to other people that Rick Warren's church stemmed from The Southern Baptist Church Convention and Baptists believe in ONCE SAVED ALWAYS SAVED, John Calvin's Holier Than Thou attitude of Christian snubs. This is nonsense theology since Christians like these don't believe in back sliding. Please do your research about your own church. More people are turning away because of this Holier than thou attitude. Also Oprah too used to be raised as a Baptist. She is now misguiding tons of people away from God and into New Age. The members you are talking about who also attend Calvary Chapel do NOT represent Pastor Smith. If you are not brave enough to speak directly to Pastor Smith then I suggest you to please get lost! Thank you.
Tina Lee April 18, 2013 at 09:20 PM
@Dusty, please make sure to mention this to ChristieD since some people can't let sleepy dogs lie. Prayers work for the individuals who trust God and have faith in Christ. There are still some in this country who trust God and experienced miracles. However, this country has already abandoned God and I am afraid God is not gonna be of a help to us if we don't want Him here in this country! if you are upset, Dusty, perhaps you should review the failing rulers who were elected by the 56% of the people. They are weak, cowardly, hypocritical and GodLESS...but after all, they are only doing their jobs by representing the people who voted for them.
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 05:30 AM
@ Tina Lee: Talk about letting sleeping dogs lie...unlike you I only check on this blog every few days. You appear to be the one wanting to "have the last word." You use this word a lot: "They" They are weak. They are cowardly. They are hypocritical. They are Godless. Yet, many do not agree with you. Some of us find you all of those things plus unkind, unChristlike, judgemental, and faithless. Many of us believe that it is up to GOD to judge. It is up to God to decide who is "more better" than the next person (haha). And this comment; "The members you are talking about who also attend Calvary Chapel do NOT represent Pastor Smith. If you are not brave enough to speak directly to Pastor Smith then I suggest you to please get lost! Thank you." Another version of "they." I was actually baptized by Chuck Smith many years ago in Corona del Mar and attended that church for years. Who are you to say that YOU are the accurate representation of him or anyone else? And that other people who disagree with YOU do not represent his views? I stand by my statement; you have an issue that causes you to lash out unkindly and violently against other people. You end with things like "get lost." How loving and "godly" of you. Seriously? A young man in agony has lost his life and is resting in the loving arms of his creator. Period. With "christians" like you out there it is no wonder people have lost faith in themselves and God. Who wants a god with a rep like you?
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 05:36 AM
And by the way, if you feel our country is so horrible and godless feel free to move to another country that more suits your preferences. This country doesn't need intolerant, unkind, judgemental, citizens. We are all trying to get along, no matter what each others' religious beliefs, creeds, ethnicities, sexual and gender orientations, personalities, and financial status' are. If you are not willing to live and let live in peace, then by all means, move out! REMINDER: this blog is about extending LOVE and MERCY to those in pain. What could be more Christlike? Keep your hate and judgement to yourself or find another blog that welcomes your horrific and unChristlike comments.
Tina Lee April 19, 2013 at 05:50 AM
First of all ChristieD, my Vietnamese/Cambodian father fought in the Vietnam War as an officer who served in the U.S. Navy, fighting against the Communists and died under Communists' hands! I didn't come over to this country in 1981 during Reagan decade to watch it turn into Liberal Communism/Socialism. I did NOT say that I hate this country! Maybe you should learn how to read? However, the 56% chose Leftists because perhaps they are either very ignorant or they are Leftists, themselves! This country is NO LONGER Christian Protestants Conservatives Constitutionalists/Fundamentalists like the Founding Fathers used to run. They would have kicked these Leftists behinds if they were living today. If you are offended by this or even offended as bringing God, Jesus Christ back into this country then maybe you need a second look at "Christian" self...if that is who you are claiming to be?!? Now, I am done with you! You are being ignored by from this comment forth. Thank you.
Tina Lee April 19, 2013 at 05:52 AM
Leftists = Democrats = Liberals = Socialists and Communists!
Dusty W Otero April 19, 2013 at 06:32 AM
There are two Chuck smith the dad and his son and guess what the whole family is a preacher family and pay no taxes,,,why is that???
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 03:38 PM
@ Tina Lee; you are so funny and childlike when you say things like: "Now, I am done with you! You are being ignored by from this comment forth. Thank you." You seriously sound like a child trying to get in the last word, then covering your ears and humming to yourself so you can pretend not to hear. As for the founding fathers and this country being "founded" as a Christian fundamentalist country. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The founding fathers made it quite clear that this was NOT founded as a Christian country and that religion should always be separated from the government. Do a little research on that soon. As for other intents of the founding fathers. At the time the wrote the constitution they had no intent to give voting rights to minorities or women. They had no intent to free slaves or to prohibit slavery. In fact, if we had gone with the "original intent" of the founding fathers, you would have zero rights as a minority and a woman. And by the way; Jesus was a bleeding heart liberal who NEVER would have even considered carrying a gun or having any of his followers carry a gun. My father was a highly ranking doctor in the Vietnam war. He treated both Americans and Vietnamese (from both sides of the fight). Love is love without putting labels on any person, whether they are socialist, communist, Muslim, Christian, gay, straight, poor, rich, or in any other category. This young man was and is LOVED by God.
Tina Lee April 19, 2013 at 03:47 PM
Dusty! What are you talking about? 7,000 die in the USA??? Who are these people? People die all of the time...that is life and death we have to face everyday! Religions and politics kill...but I have a relationship with Christ. I am a Protestant Christian and had never killed anyone in all of my life! However throughout history, the Catholic Church, (including Hitler Socialism/Russia's Communism Atheists/Heathen Barbarians) were killing Protestants, Jews, and even some Native Americans under the Spanish Inquisition and the reign of "Bloody Mary" more than anybody could count! Both the Jews and Protestant Christians have suffered the most thus we call ourselves Judeo-Christians, sometimes. Even TODAY, the Islamist world and China's communists are persecuting and killing Protestant Christians and newly converted Christians; they are martyrs for Christ. 7,000 is a pathetic number plus you are vague about your half truth/half lies. Yes, these people won't talk about suicides because they are from the "Holier than thou, Once saved ALWAYS saved Christians". It is hypocritical of them HOWEVER you are NOT the JUDGE in whom to send to hell or not. As for his parents, just because they are pastors or missionaries, does NOT mean their son/daughter will be automatically saved. Just like if you live in a garage, it doesn't make you a car! If murderers think they can escape the world, they are wrong. We can't escape God's Judgement; we are all accountable/answer to God, individually!!!
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 03:50 PM
@ Dusty: I guess I am a "Jesus freak" in that he is my hero in terms of how he was on this Earth and what he stood for. I, however, am not a "religious freak" in that I judge the validity of other's peoples beliefs. In fact, I think ALL faiths have lessons to give and isn't that the point? To love ALL people? And I agree with you about the mega-churches. Today's church has lost focus and contact with the original point of having a "church." Money spent on the "new building fund," etc. The original church collected money to care for the poor, period. People have warped the true message of God, which is love and forgiveness for ALL. Those who claim it for their own and no one else's who don't believe as they do are self-righteous, bigoted, and deceived. I know nothing about this young man, except that he was a tortured man, for whatever reasons. I do know about Warren, and while I do not agree with him on MANY things, I know that he and his family are grieving the loss of a CHILD of theirs. Nothing could be more painful. This is not the time for judgement from any of us. Only sorrow at the loss of a human being in such a tragic circumstance. And your last comment about other countries praying to kill the U.S.A.; you are 100% correct; it's like the football team praying to God to win the game, as if God is on their side only. God love ALL people; we are NOT the elite!
Tina Lee April 19, 2013 at 03:55 PM
@Dusty: I was talking about the PASTOR. There is only one pastor. Like I said just because you are the son of a pastor does NOT make you automatically saved and pastor! I do NOT know the son and I don't know what you are talking about not paying tax. Please be specific. Like I said if these pastors' kids think they can get away with things then they are wrong, they too will answer to God, individually and can NOT piggy back on their parents' religion, whatever it is. I had sat throughout PASTOR Smith's services for a year and had NEVER heard of such a claim, inside or outside of his church. I am not even sure what proof do you have besides the lies, rumors and gossips you may be duped of buying but after reading your first comment claiming only a measly 7,000 dying in the USA in a very vague way, I am NOT impressed with your sources!
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 09:09 PM
This is an excellent article about a very relevant study: http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/04/17/study-belief-in-an-angry-god-associated-with-variety-of-mental-illnesses/
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 09:43 PM
Another excellent resource: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/nakedpastor/2013/04/is-god-a-great-big-bully/
ChristieD April 19, 2013 at 09:44 PM
Yet another excellent resource: http://www.patheos.com/blogs/nakedpastor/2013/04/is-god-a-great-big-bully/
Herb April 19, 2013 at 11:48 PM
Tina, I have not visited the site for a while and I see that you are still making it your personal forum. That is unfortunate, because you have violated the purpose of the site. This is not a place for theological discussion, for the putting down of other believers or condemnation of a family or their dead child. Please consider others in your discourse.


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